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THFC6061
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Posted: Thu May 3rd, 2012 09:18 pm |
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Bolton v West Brom (Sunday, 14:00 BST)
From what I saw of Bolton in their defeat by Tottenham on Wednesday, they played quite well in patches without ever looking like they were going to win the game.
I don't think Wanderers will lose again at home against West Brom but I am going to go for a draw here, which is a result which will not do them too much good in their battle against the drop.
To be honest, I just get a little bit of a sinking feeling about Owen Coyle's team. After having a good run where they went three games unbeaten, they just seem to have hit the buffers again - and it could also be significant that their goal difference is now worse than that of both Blackburn and QPR, as well as Wigan and Aston Villa.
It is a difficult game to call, because other than knowing that their manager Roy Hodgson is leaving, West Brom have nothing to play for. The thing about that is it means they will be completely relaxed and fearless.
What next for West Brom when Hodgson goes? Well, there are plenty of people out there who will fancy a Premier League job.
You would look at Steve Bruce, who is out of work, but also there will be one or two Championship managers who might not come up via the play-offs, like Birmingham's Chris Hughton or Ian Holloway at Blackpool, who will undoubtedly be in the picture.
Prediction: Bolton 1-1 West Brom
Here are all of Lawro's 2011-12 Premier League Predictions, together with how the League Table would look like if all his forecasts were correct...
http://www.myfootballfacts.com/Mark_Lawrensons_Predictions_2011-12.html
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Billy Bradshaw
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 07:02 am |
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Can't really get excited about this. I'm tempted to think that we're surely bound to beat West Brom.......but it isn't necessarily the case is it? 
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mikey
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 07:33 am |
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| As long as we get a point - or hope that QPR don't get a win, we're still in the hunt. Then it's all down to the last day. It's been a while since it's been a last day make or break, and to be honest, I haven't missed them. Oh for something like that Fredi Bobic hat-trick in the first half against Ipswich to settle the nerves......
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Billy Bradshaw
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 07:38 am |
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| Who knows......it would be typical Bolton if we did save ourselves at the last minute. Our players only seem to come alive when they feel they have to.
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Valderee
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 07:47 am |
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Tear it down and start again (woh woh)
Woy to celebrate his new job big style and go one better than 'Arry by keeping a clean sheet. As per prediction thread, 0-4.
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flamingboy
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 08:19 am |
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My expectations are not that high where Bolton are concerned. Not having the money and resources that the bigger clubs have means they’ll always play 2nd fiddle along with a host of other clubs that fit into that grouping. That doesn’t mean to say that BWFC can’t make it in the premiership, on the contrary; this was achieved by Sam Allardyce regardless of whether one likes or dislikes his methods and / or strategies / playing style. Either way he got the RESULTS that were necessary to at least make us look ‘respectable’ from a league table standpoint.
I’d be happy with a mid-table finish season in season out with an occasional break into the top ten and again this was achieved by Allardyce. I’m sure others on this board can go into great depth providing reasons as to why we are where we are. Personally, I look at the bottom line and I’m at the stage now where it is no longer acceptable and it is time that Gartside got off his backside and sorted this mess out once and for all.
I have to agree with Billy in that I have a certain amount of disposable income and would be happy to invest in a family season ticket. I’m afraid that I’m only prepared to do that should Bolton stay in the prem, they have to earn my money albeit that I’ll always support them.
If Coyle takes this club into the Championship there’s no getting away from the fact that this club could sink further and I’m sure others can provide examples of where this has happened. Considering those clubs affected, especially ones that are finding it an uphill struggle to get back to the prem, for them it was and is devastating in being relegated.
We are now at the brink. Coyle can only be judged by results and the end result reflects one of two outcomes, success or failure...there is no middle ground here. It’s too close for comfort and I’m still not sure whether he’s the right man. What I do know is that Coyle is getting seriously close to ‘failure’ and I hope he realises what the end result could be in lost revenue not to mention the many fans that won’t renew their season tickets.
What I do know is that out there in the big wide world, with the vast majority of companies in the private sector, Coyle, in all probability, would have been fired by now for falling way below the mark of what would be deemed as reasonable or acceptable.
In closing I would say that I do believe that Coyle doesn’t want to fail or get Bolton relegated, of course he doesn’t. I also believe that he feels he’s doing his best, I can accept that. However, as we all know, sometimes one’s best just isn’t good enough.
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Greeny2
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 09:37 am |
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flamingboy wrote:
My expectations are not that high where Bolton are concerned. Not having the money and resources that the bigger clubs have means they’ll always play 2nd fiddle along with a host of other clubs that fit into that grouping. That doesn’t mean to say that BWFC can’t make it in the premiership, on the contrary; this was achieved by Sam Allardyce regardless of whether one likes or dislikes his methods and / or strategies / playing style. Either way he got the RESULTS that were necessary to at least make us look ‘respectable’ from a league table standpoint.
I’d be happy with a mid-table finish season in season out with an occasional break into the top ten and again this was achieved by Allardyce. I’m sure others on this board can go into great depth providing reasons as to why we are where we are. Personally, I look at the bottom line and I’m at the stage now where it is no longer acceptable and it is time that Gartside got off his backside and sorted this mess out once and for all.
I have to agree with Billy in that I have a certain amount of disposable income and would be happy to invest in a family season ticket. I’m afraid that I’m only prepared to do that should Bolton stay in the prem, they have to earn my money albeit that I’ll always support them.
If Coyle takes this club into the Championship there’s no getting away from the fact that this club could sink further and I’m sure others can provide examples of where this has happened. Considering those clubs affected, especially ones that are finding it an uphill struggle to get back to the prem, for them it was and is devastating in being relegated.
We are now at the brink. Coyle can only be judged by results and the end result reflects one of two outcomes, success or failure...there is no middle ground here. It’s too close for comfort and I’m still not sure whether he’s the right man. What I do know is that Coyle is getting seriously close to ‘failure’ and I hope he realises what the end result could be in lost revenue not to mention the many fans that won’t renew their season tickets.
What I do know is that out there in the big wide world, with the vast majority of companies in the private sector, Coyle, in all probability, would have been fired by now for falling way below the mark of what would be deemed as reasonable or acceptable.
In closing I would say that I do believe that Coyle doesn’t want to fail or get Bolton relegated, of course he doesn’t. I also believe that he feels he’s doing his best, I can accept that. However, as we all know, sometimes one’s best just isn’t good enough.
I agree with most of what has been said here. To be fair to Phil and Eddie though, Coyle was offered resources but refused to use them. He has admitted that himself and went on to say that he felt that he had a good enough squad to stay up - even a top ten squad. So in that respect blame can't be attached to the chairman and the owner.
Many on here feel that sticking with the manager will prove to be the right thing to do in the end. They will of course point to Colin Todd where we were relegated under Toddy and went straight back up, only to go back down again and eventually find ourselves in the lower region of what is now called the Championship. We of course stuck with Phil Neal for 7 / 8 years and went nowhere fast.
Personally I feel that that is only the right thing to do if you stay up. If we are relegated, no matter how unfortunately, the personally I think we should sack him.
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BringBackBurndenPark
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 10:50 am |
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| It's so tough to call because you don't know how WestBrom will react to the manager leaving.
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Greeny2
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 11:00 am |
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BringBackBurndenPark wrote:
It's so tough to call because you don't know how WestBrom will react to the manager leaving.
This battle is going to the wire. Wouldn't be suprised if we won and Qpr won. Wouldn't be suprised if we lost and Qpr lost.
We have to get at least a draw out of this match. I still think QPR will beat City on the last day.
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adlyd_wanderers
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 11:54 am |
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Odemwingie a doubt with a hamstring, Morrison back in contention
From WBA website.
Mixed news there then.
We will survive and people will look back and be saying OC is a messiah for getting us out of the shit (but not think of who, in the main, put us there in the first place with is 4-4 -f***ing 2 formation)
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mikey
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 12:38 pm |
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If we do survive, OC is definately not my messiah! I like the guy as a person, but as manager of my team, I don't think that the job he has done this season has been good enough. Right from 'that' semi final, things have gone down hill drastically. You could say we've been unlucky with Holden, CYL, Mears etc etc. But the quality of players that have been brought in have not been good enough.
I didn't agree with Tuncay, I didn't agree with Ngog. I would give Klasnic a full second half every game (if I wasn't starting him!). Some say he is lazy, but he scores goals! Ngog works hard, but doesn't - they are both strikers. Maybe we couldn't / can't attract the type of players that we once had, in which case we certainly need to be bringing good decent players through our academy, who don't cost millions and aren't on 'silly' wages. Otherwise, what is the point of having academies?
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Istanbilly
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 12:56 pm |
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| Don't want to get involved in OC part of this thread, but we are not down and out yet. Oh granted, we aren't far away from it and I think I want to be one of the 'Where there's life there's hope brigade'. I really do think we will win this one (for what it is worth I also thought we might beat Spurs as well, so my judgement is open to question anyway), but three points this weekend will certainly ensure that our hopes remain alive. My hope is that City are in the position where they have win when they take the field against QPR, if they have to I think they will and we may, just, squeak into the Premier League for at least one more season.
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flamingboy
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 01:07 pm |
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I would echo Mikey’s comments in that I would certainly not hail Coyle as a messiah in any regard. If we do, by chance, survive then Coyle ought to be dragged over the coals and made to face the errors and blunders orchestrated by him. He and only he can be held accountable. He’s on the bridge and is coming close to catastrophically steering our ship into the rocks. If the ship does capsize then I don’t see many fans ready to toss him a life jacket, so to speak.
I find it shocking and scandalous that Coyle refused to accept funds that allegedly were offered to him and also find it extremely cavalier and foolhardy that he made that decision. Some would say that it was an opportunity missed in that he could have at least provided additional cover and strength to the squad. By all accounts he chose to ignore the funds that were offered and only time will tell as to whether that was just one gamble too many.
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observer
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 01:39 pm |
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flamingboy wrote: I would echo Mikey’s comments in that I would certainly not hail Coyle as a messiah in any regard. If we do, by chance, survive then Coyle ought to be dragged over the coals and made to face the errors and blunders orchestrated by him. He and only he can be held accountable. He’s on the bridge and is coming close to catastrophically steering our ship into the rocks. If the ship does capsize then I don’t see many fans ready to toss him a life jacket, so to speak.
I find it shocking and scandalous that Coyle refused to accept funds that allegedly were offered to him and also find it extremely cavalier and foolhardy that he made that decision. Some would say that it was an opportunity missed in that he could have at least provided additional cover and strength to the squad. By all accounts he chose to ignore the funds that were offered and only time will tell as to whether that was just one gamble too many. Perhaps and only perhaps, OC did not find anything to his liking that he wanted to spend money on. Judging from the caliber that we did bring in, he probably was not offered enough to get a quality player, or there may not have been quality players available. At this point, let's hope we win this week and QPR has two bad weeks and gets nothing. Survival is at stake and hopefully OC can instill a hunger to survive in these lads.
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flamingboy
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 01:58 pm |
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I can accept the argument, but not agree, that although funds were made available Coyle chose not to use them simply because he couldn’t have the player/s he wanted.
I want a brand new Rolls but, hey ho, life goes on.
As a manager you can only play the best hand with the cards you’re dealt. I don’t buy it for a second that there is not one player/s out there that would have fitted somewhere within his plans. If that is his mindset at Bolton in that he chooses not to spend simply because he can’t have the player he wants, then that attitude is a doomed one way ticket to failure.
Management is about seeking the correct or best route to achieve your objectives with the resources you have. Coyle should be grateful that at least there are some monetary resources there available.
Furthermore and again, if money was made available for him to spend then quite simply somebody somewhere in his entourage is NOT doing his or her job. These are just excuses and simply ‘wouldn’t wash’ out there in the real world.
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Cowdrill
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Posted: Fri May 4th, 2012 04:40 pm |
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Players are knackered and carrying all sorts of knocks and lack bottle at home
Draw at best I reckon
I want them to show some balls and fight for this club but I fear we will get the same half arsed rubbish we got against fulham and swansea etc etc
It's all over
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scentless_apprentice
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 02:00 am |
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Billy Bradshaw wrote: Who knows......it would be typical Bolton if we did save ourselves at the last minute. Our players only seem to come alive when they feel they have to.
I fear that it was typical of the Bolton of old, for better or worse we are a changed club now.
I can't help feeling that although i see a 451 formation with Miatchi Muamba,Holden,NRC and LCY in midfield as an exciting and a lot more caplable line up, the excitement we all craved, without our key players has been our down fall.The injuries are not OC's fault but as we've said all along he has no plan B.
We might just scrape by but for Bolton Wanderers the times they are a changing.
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Philsfaxmachine
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 07:33 am |
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Cowdrill wrote:
Players are knackered and carrying all sorts of knocks and lack bottle at home
Draw at best I reckon
I want them to show some balls and fight for this club but I fear we will get the same half arsed rubbish we got against fulham and swansea etc etc
It's all over
Bang on, down with a whimper. QPR signed people who can score goals in January and they will batter Stoke tomorrow 3 or 4 nil. We will not put up a fight against WBA and be effectively down tomorrow.
A drubbing at Stoke will see us relegated without another point on the board.
Reasons, primarily a tactically inept manager and poor coaching team. Poor signings last summer, poor business in January including the sale of an England centre half and injuries to two key players.
Goodbye premiership - ten years hard work ruined by Coyle.
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Woody
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 08:23 am |
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Philsfaxmachine wrote:
Cowdrill wrote:
Players are knackered and carrying all sorts of knocks and lack bottle at home
Draw at best I reckon
I want them to show some balls and fight for this club but I fear we will get the same half arsed rubbish we got against fulham and swansea etc etc
It's all over
Bang on, down with a whimper. QPR signed people who can score goals in January and they will batter Stoke tomorrow 3 or 4 nil. We will not put up a fight against WBA and be effectively down tomorrow.
A drubbing at Stoke will see us relegated without another point on the board.
Reasons, primarily a tactically inept manager and poor coaching team. Poor signings last summer, poor business in January including the sale of an England centre half and injuries to two key players.
Goodbye premiership - ten years hard work ruined by Coyle.
The points you make are acceptable until the last exaggeration. We've been waiting to go down for a couple of years before Coyle came. It's just been a matter of time. All Coyle can arguably be is the final nail. But let's not pretend that Sammy Lee and Megson were improving this club, or in any way shape or form keeping us on solid ground. It's just not true. Last edited on Sat May 5th, 2012 08:24 am by Woody
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Greeny2
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 08:49 am |
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Woody wrote:
Philsfaxmachine wrote:
Cowdrill wrote:
Players are knackered and carrying all sorts of knocks and lack bottle at home
Draw at best I reckon
I want them to show some balls and fight for this club but I fear we will get the same half arsed rubbish we got against fulham and swansea etc etc
It's all over
Bang on, down with a whimper. QPR signed people who can score goals in January and they will batter Stoke tomorrow 3 or 4 nil. We will not put up a fight against WBA and be effectively down tomorrow.
A drubbing at Stoke will see us relegated without another point on the board.
Reasons, primarily a tactically inept manager and poor coaching team. Poor signings last summer, poor business in January including the sale of an England centre half and injuries to two key players.
Goodbye premiership - ten years hard work ruined by Coyle.
The points you make are acceptable until the last exaggeration. We've been waiting to go down for a couple of years before Coyle came. It's just been a matter of time. All Coyle can arguably be is the final nail. But let's not pretend that Sammy Lee and Megson were improving this club, or in any way shape or form keeping us on solid ground. It's just not true.
I agree with Woody, I don't put it all down to Coyle.
Though, other than the three major injuries, the rest of the injuries can be put down to how the club 'train' and look after the players.
Since Allardyce left we have lacked a plan and a manager with a purpose. Allardyce introduced the club to Sports Science and Prozone which have now been pushed to one side either through cost cutting measures or a series of managers who don't want to /don't know how to use the technology.
The other thing that concerns me about Coyle is he doesn't seem to spy on the opposition. Does he do it by MOD videos?
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Cowdrill
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 10:58 am |
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He doesnt spy on them
He just goes on about how great they are all the time
Motivates the opposition team more than he does ours!
The BN reckons CYL may play after all...
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BringBackBurndenPark
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 11:45 am |
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| Players pick up all kinds of knocks when they are shit scared and don't want to play.
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Greeny2
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 12:10 pm |
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BringBackBurndenPark wrote:
Players pick up all kinds of knocks when they are shit scared and don't want to play.
They'll be scared after Sundays match, suspect there may well be a backlash if we lose and QPR win, we will be down. When the crowd have had a go at them they wont play again! In fact if we don't win if it is all over now then no win on Sunday and you can definitely start sobbing in your beer.Last edited on Sat May 5th, 2012 12:12 pm by Greeny2
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Valderee
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 12:22 pm |
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Cowdrill wrote:
The BN reckons CYL may play after all...
:what: 
I hope not for Chungy's sake. On the bench for a last 5 mins cameo maybe.
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Is there any club left in England
Or any ground left in England
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flamingboy
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 12:28 pm |
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I do put it all down to Coyle despite injuries, bad luck, blah blah blah.
He's the manager and takes FULL responsibility, harsh as that may sound.
Premiership is à ruthless place so why should an exception be made here for Coyle?
He's in charge and should have made sure his bases were covered. Truth is he didn't and has left himself exposed and now it should come as no surprise that he's now getting so much negativistic criticism.
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rizlar
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 12:52 pm |
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I agree with flamingboy the bucks stops with the manager irrespective of what he inherited etc he is out of his depth.
As stated on another thread will not stay after the final whistle on Sunday whatever the result as the whole lot of them players manager and staff in my opinion have let the fans down badly.
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bdi
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 12:56 pm |
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QPR will not win against City on the last day of the season...
City if within a shout of picking up the trophy, then no way will they lose.
Tomorrows game as more meaning on survival that the last game of the season. We better QPR's result, then IMO we will stay up...
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rizlar
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 01:00 pm |
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| I am of the same opinion as you bdi no way will City lose to QPR we win against WBA we will stay up because I dont think QPR will beat Stoke I am convinced of it.
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BringBackBurndenPark
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 01:08 pm |
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| We need man city and man u to match eachothers results ideally and of corse to win our own game.
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Tweek
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Posted: Sat May 5th, 2012 01:12 pm |
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rizlar wrote:
I am of the same opinion as you bdi no way will City lose to QPR we win against WBA we will stay up because I dont think QPR will beat Stoke I am convinced of it. We,ve had it then.
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